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Fun With Stats: A Mythical All-Time Illinois State XC Meet

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ILXCTF - Mike Newman   Dec 14th 2018, 4:27pm
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By Michael Newman

[email protected]

 

I had just finished publishing my 2018 Illinois State Cross-Country team rankings. I received a text message from Neuqua Valley Coach Paul Vandersteen.

“It would be harder to do, but it would be fun to do your ranking with the top 30 teams of all time,” Vandersteen stated. “Not just the total team time at the state meet.”

Challenge accepted.

I had to first develop criteria on how I would do this list. I came up with this.

1 – I could not go through all of the results and choose the top 30 teams that I would evaluate. Choosing the top 30 Boys teams starting in 1971 is almost impossible. I could choose the teams but that would enter bias into this study. The accuracy would be diminished.

2 – I though maybe I could just go through every team that won a state championship. Again, that would take me months. At the same time, there are some great second, third (etc.) teams that could compete with some of the state championship teams. Again, the accuracy would be diminished.

3 – Where I could get the most accurate result of finding who the top team in both the Boys and Girls teams is to go off the Top 50 All Time Lists (by time) to determine the top teams. The accuracy of this study would improve.

4 – I decided to stay with 30 teams. It’s the right size to figure all of this out. I could go with the top 50 teams but there are more variances in the outcome of the result. Too low of a number of teams in figuring this out we have the same problem with variance of the outcome where we would not get an accurate answer. You can see the Top 50 lists in these links – BOYSGIRLS

5 – When I started listing times with fastest first, there were a large amount of number of runners that had the same time. In this study, there are some runners in the same meet year that had the same time. To keep this study fair, all same times would not be broken. Runners with the same times would have an average point total given to them. No ties would be broken.

 

There is more data to analyze on the Boys teams compared to the Girls. Boys started to run 3.0-Miles at Detweiller Park in 1971. Girls teams started to run on Detweiller Park in 1979 with a 2.1-mile distance. In 1998, the IHSA changed the Girls Distance to 2.5-miles. In 2002, the Girls distance was moved up to the current distance of 3.0-miles. We only have data for 3.0 miles from 2002 on.

There are two different eras for Boys Cross Country in Illinois: Before NXN and the NXN era. You also have variances in the Detweiller Park course. A study was commissioned by DyeStat.com in 2008 (DETWEILLER LINK) showing the changes in the course from 1971 until it changed to the current course from 2002 to 2005.

Because of the differences between the two eras, it is tougher to come up with a fair comparison. For this study, it is close enough where we get a good idea of how good the top 30 teams are and get a fair comparison.

 

BOYS STUDY ANALYSIS

There were 13 teams before 2004 (when the Nike Team Nationals started) that have team times that are in the top 30. 17 teams since 2004 have made it into the top 30. It gives us a good idea that we are in a “Golden Age” of Distance running in this state. The first “Golden Age” occurred in the 1970’s. 12 teams in the 1970’s are on this list. York’s 1999 team is the only other team on this list before NTN/NXN started.

York has 12 teams that are listed in the top 30. The next closest programs are Deerfield (1976, 1977), Neuqua Valley (2007, 2016), and Downers Grove North (2016, 2017) all with two teams on the top 30 teams involved in this study.

RESULTS

York’s team from 1999 has the fastest total team time ever run at the IHSA State Meet (72:37). In this study, York had the lowest point total with 176.5 points. York’s 2005 team is second on the fastest time list (73:11) and was also second with 236 points). York’s 2006 team was third with 301.5 points.

In the top 10 teams using the point analysis, five teams from each of the era’s are included. The top 1970’s team was the Deerfield 1977 team (#6) followed by Maine East 1979 (#8), Deerfield 1976 (#9), and York 1979 (#10).

Sandburg 2015 has the sixth fastest team time ever (73:38). In this study, they finished fourth overall (324 points) with Neuqua Valley 2016 just three points back (327 points).

 

GIRLS STUDY ANALYSIS

It is a given that Girls Distance running in Illinois (and in the United States) is improving yearly and has showed the greatest increase of improvement in this state in the last four years. We’ve had two runners (Judy Pendergast – Naperville North 2015 – 1553.8 and Katelynne Hart  - Glenbard West 2018 – 15:59.9) run under 16-minutes. That could double in the next two years.

Geneva is the oldest team in this top 30 team study (2008). Half (15) of the teams in the top 30 are schools that ran in state meets from 2015 until 2018. That is a ton in the past four years. The other 15 schools are from a seven-year period (2008-2014).

Naperville North’s program has the most teams in the top 30 with six (2012, 2014-18). Glenbard West is next with five teams (2012-15, 2017).

RESULTS

We said after this year’s state meet that Naperville North and Yorkville ran the fastest team times ever faster than the next closest team by almost a minute.

In the state meet, the two teams were separated by seven points with Naperville North winning their third straight state title. When using those times in a mythical state meet with 28 other great teams, the 2018 teams from Naperville North and Yorkville came up with the same point total (225 points). Naperville North’s depth from their sixth and seventh runners gave the Lady Huskies the tie-break win.

Four of the six Naperville North teams finished in the top 10. Their 2017 team was the closest to the 2018 teams but 89 points back in third (314 points). Naperville North 2012 was fourth (333 points) followed by Minooka 2015 (335.5 points).

Six teams from 2015-2018 were in the top 10 with Minooka 2016  (#8) and Downers Grove South 2018 (#9) the other teams from that era.

 

BOYS TEAM RESULTS

 

1 York 1999 176.5   2 29 35 39 71.5 118.5 184.5
2 York 2005 236   16.5 19 49 57.5 94 108.5 184.5
3 York 2006 301.5   21 25 53 94 108.5 128.5 148
4 Sandburg 2015 324.5   14.5 43.5 57.5 94 115 161.5 173.5
5 Neuqua Valley 2016 327.5   25 53 71.5 76.5 101.5 101.5 133
6 Deerfield 1977 335.5   12 25 39 123 136.5 178  
7 Downers North 2017 339   35 66.5 71.5 76.5 89.5 158.5 200
8 Maine East 1979 360   43.5 63 66.5 85.5 101.5 191 198.5
9 Deerfield 1976 363.5   25 43.5 49 115 131 156  
10 York 1979 367   25 57.5 63 76.5 145 164 181
11 York 1974 367   10 18 83 123 133 176.5 179.5
12 York 1973 381.5   49 53 63 101.5 115 152.5 161.5
13 York 2012 387.5   12 76.5 79.5 83 136.5 145 186
14 Neuqua Valley 2007 390   1 29 68 118.5 173.5 188 190
15 Lyons Township 2015 407   21 32 87.5 101.5 165 172 197
16 Rvrsd-Brkfld 1973 412.5   6 8.5 79.5 149.5 169    
17 Lake Zurich 2010 414.5   39 43.5 43.5 112 176.5 192 194
18 Downers North 2016 416   37 43.5 89.5 123 123 141.5 166.5
19 Bloom Township 1974 419.5   29 57.5 101.5 108.5 123 156 187
20 Whtn-Wrnvl So 2018 422   21 49 63 145 145 152.5 189
21 Naperville North 2008 422.5   14.5 32 81 136.5 158.5 198.5 201
22 O'Fallon 2012 435   6 6 128.5 145 149.5 166.5 193
23 Wheaton North 1976 442   32 35 94 128.5 152.5    
24 York 1978 445.5   49 71.5 101.5 108.5 115 139.5 175
25 York 1971 445.5   63 71.5 87.5 108.5 115 152.5  
26 York 2008 451   8.5 12 133 141.5 156 161.5 170.5
27 York 1972 457.5   57.5 83 85.5 108.5 123 161.5 182
28 York 2007 459   4 16.5 128.5 139.5 170.5 196 203
29 Belvidere North 2010 462.5   57.5 94 94 94 123 179.5 183
30 Hersey 2018 480.5   3 71.5 101.5 136.5 168 195 202

 

GIRLS TEAM RESULTS

 

1 Naperville N 2018 225   3 37 53.5 61 70.5 72.5 80.5
2 Yorkville 2018 225   9.5 16.5 22 67.5 109.5 153 158.5
3 Naperville N 2017 314   8 15 43.5 114 133.5 148 156
4 Naperville N 2012 333   30 43.5 56.5 100.5 102.5 127.5 209
5 Minooka 2015 335.5   11 33 39.5 121.5 130.5 200 204
6 Naperville N 2014 351   49 53.5 56.5 95 97 142 170.5
7 Glenbard W 2014 351.5   6 35.5 74.5 116 119.5 123.5 172
8 Minooka 2016 363.5   16.5 23 61 76 187 196 201
9 Downers South 2018 366   14 67.5 83 99 102.5 121.5 161.5
10 New Trier 2012 367   7 29 35.5 139.5 156 177 179.5
11 Palatine 2014 380   27.5 72.5 77 97 106 142 142
12 Naperville N 2016 384.5   25 64.5 67.5 104 123.5 179.5 186
13 Glenbard W 2012 387.5   2 21 108 117 139.5 169 188.5
14 Schaumburg 2010 390.5   27.5 33 63 133.5 133.5 188.5 197
15 Naperville N 2015 393   1 39.5 111 114 127.5 144 182
16 Lake Park 2012 393.5   13 58 83 106 133.5 146 153
17 New Trier 2011 405.5   24 53.5 59 119.5 149.5 193 198
18 Yorkville 2017 409   39.5 46.5 61 125 137 137 190.5
19 Geneva 2008 409   51 53.5 88.5 88.5 127.5 167 184.5
20 Palatine 2010 417   19.5 49 91.5 106 151 161.5 174.5
21 Glenbard W 2013 419   39.5 64.5 80.5 88.5 146 167 173
22 Glenbard W 2017 423.5   5 12 46.5 177 183 190.5 206.5
23 Yorkville 2016 428.5   43.5 78.5 85.5 93.5 127.5 193 205
24 Geneva 2010 438   18 67.5 88.5 97 167 193 202.5
25 Whtn-Wrnvl So 2010 439.5   43.5 49 85.5 112 149.5 184.5  
26 Hinsdale C 2015 463   19.5 31 78.5 153 181 206.5 208
27 Hinsdale C 2014 478   33 70.5 91.5 137 146 164.5 199
28 Batavia 2015 488.5   26 83 109.5 114 156 158.5 195
29 Belvidere N 2016 500.5   9.5 74.5 93.5 161.5 161.5 164.5 202.5
30 Glenbard W 2015 523.5   4 100.5 118 130.5 170.5 174.5 177

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